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Community Forums › How Can I locate my Family in Italy › Southern Italy › castellian

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castellian

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nuccia
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:29 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Pat,

It's very similiar. You would need to have them order the microfilms for you and then you would view it in almost the same manner as the microfiche..using a viewer. You need to find out if your library can order from Salt Lake.

Have a look here:

www.familysearch.org and read through the pages. I will be back later and try to offer more info. Kids just got up and they want breakfast! Sad

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mahart
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 2:35 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Hi Pat,
Sorry guys, hope you don't mind me jumping in but I’m also from Liverpool and may be able to help.

Pat you can’t order the microfiche films at Central Library you need to order at the LDS Family History Centre (Mormon history centre). It is situated in the Latter Day Church on Mill Bank next to the college just off Queens Dive, the junction where the Jolly Miller pub is but the opposite side. (Tel 0151 252 0614)
The films are about £2.75 inc postage each.

Below I’ve posted the film numbers that contain birth registrations for the likely years for your ancestor on the civil registration for births (Nati) for Naples

Nati 1838-1839 FHL INTL Film
1807723
Nati 1839-1840 FHL INTL Film
1807724
Nati 1840-1841 FHL INTL Film
1807725
Nati 1841-1843 FHL INTL Film
1807908
Nati 1843-1844 FHL INTL Film
1807909

Pat I also research Scouse Italian ancestors and I try to get down to the family history centre Tuesday or and Wednesday mornings to research (work permitting) so if you want, and call down when I am there I will help you order the films. The films can take awhile to come because they come from Salt Lake City in USA but the centre will call you when they arrive to arrange a date for you to come in.
Don’t worry about not being good with computers and stuff, there are people there like on this forum that will help you.
Regarding the surname I think Nuccia has it right it seems it has changed over time. He may not have been able to write his name so it may have been phonetically spelt, believe me based on experience, Southern Italian accents and the Scouse accent are a world apart.
It may be worth you posting the different name variations you have for him from the 1861 census onwards,
Also , does it always state Naples for place of birth?
Also check on the marriage certificate if he can write (if he can’t on the section where it is signed it will have a large X before the name).

Mark

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:48 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Hi Mark,

Don't ever hesitate to jump in and help out. No one here takes offense to it ........ as a matter of fact it's welcomed. I think it's great that you live near Pat and are offering to help out with the films in person.

I've still got my fingers crossed that the marriage record will have some good information.

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p.duvall
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 7:52 am    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

hello mark and everyone here who have been helping me, well its monday today and the postman hasent been yet (hope he comes before i go to work) tommorow is the day i should recive the cert (cant wait) and mark thanks for you help also as i live near the airport and dont drive i will only be able to go to the lds centre in queens drive when im off work i work in a school so when the school breaks up for the easter hols in about 5 weeks i will go then but i will ring them too order the films for then thanks again for all your help and i will let you know what the marriage cert says when i get it.
pat
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mahart
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 8:48 am    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Thanks Elizabeth,

Okay Pat, any problems let us know and yes let us know about the marriage certificate.

Mark

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:43 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

hi all,
wednesday today and still no certificate!!!! maybe tommorrow
pat
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nuccia
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2009 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Pat..I can't believe it's taking this long. Maybe Carole will know if there is a number to call to speed things up since I think she went through a similar incident when she order a certificate from them.

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mahart
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:00 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Pat if you ordered from GRO in Southport the enquiry number for certificate enquiries is :
Tel: +44 (0) 845 603 7788 (8am to 8pm Monday to Friday. Saturday 9am to 4pm).
I'm going to apologise in advance for any potential anxiety this may cause and I do not claim to know anything about Naples but Pat do you know for sure that Matthew was Italian I mean the name found by Nuccia registered for the marriage 'Costello' as is the name Castello are also both Irish names as well as Italian, and quite common in Liverpool and I'm not sure on this but didn't Naples have a sizeable British population during the 19th century so is there a possibility they were from Liverpool and he was born there.

It is just a suggestion and its a pity he did not live to the 1911 census as for the first time people had to put there nationality and place of birth in fact it was the first census to be filled in by the occupant as opposed to the enumerator.

Mark

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

hi all,
well now i'm not sure of anything anymore (lol) i had a phone call this morning from the registry office regarding the cert i orderd, the woman wanted to query it as i had put on the form a matthew castellian married to mary mcannally, she said she had searched over 5 years census and the only marriage of a mary mcannally was to a matthew costella for the year i gave her, but matthew dident sign his name (you were right mark) he just put a cross so obviously he was illiterate, i told her to send it anyway, so now i'm thinking, was my mother right all them years ago when she told me matthew was italian and his surname was castellen(not sure of the spelling) and now i'm wondering if that was his correct name but the spelling on the cert is wrong as castellan and costella sound similar, as i said earlier i thought this was his surname but i got in touch with a distant reletive through my search and he insists the name is castellian (and wont budge on it) i dident ask the woman on the phone about what name is given for matthews father but am wondering if they have just automatically put it as costella,
matthew dosent appear on the census untill 1861 and on each year his name is spelt different,
it also said on one of the census matthew was a naturalised british subjet on another it said forien subject so i would think he was definatly italian but i dont know if his paents were and i dont think its ever going to be likely i will ever find out but my curiosity is getting the better of me so i will wait till i get the cert tommorow (fri) as the woman said she will put it in the post tonight so fingers crossed i get it tomorow i cant wait to see what info is on it
let you know when it comes
pat
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nuccia
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:55 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Ok Pat..

Lets break this down a bit. Lets forget for a minute the hearsay and look at what you do know, ok?

Lets suppose he is Italian and from Naples. We will start with his first name. Matthew is Matteo so we MAY be looking for a Matteo.

Now, the last name. Castellano seems to be a VERY common surname in Naples. We can see this by searching sites such as www.stevemorse.org and at www.gens.labo.net/it/c...enera.html It sounds and is similar in spelling to Castellian so a possibility could be

Matteo Castellano

Costello is also found in Naples, but only a few. I would wait for the certificate, and then order the microfilms as suggested earlier for the years that he could have been born in (they should all be on one film) and see if you can match a name with Matteo or his parents. Keep in mind THERE MAY VERY WELL BE DIFFERENCES. Thats what you're going to have to research. The marriage certificate you requested will NOT have the name you asked for because as I showed you, he registered it is Costello. It is the same person. He also registered his oldest daughters birth as Costello and then changed the family name I believe by the birth of the second child. If you're looking for an exact match, I doubt you will find it online or through the records in England. He had already changed the name by then and so researching through Italian records is the only way to go now. Mark has a lot of experience with researching Italian records in England so I would pick his brains a bit more and be open to other ideas. I really honestly believe this is the only way for you to go now.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:29 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

Hi Pat,

What was Matthew called on the 1861 and the 1871 census's I have tried to locate him on Ancestry using different variation of the name but to no avail.
It might help if someone else has a look at these census returns.

Mark

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 4:27 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

hi nuccia,mark and everyone else who has been searching for me, well first the good news is the certificate has arrived, the information on it is the marriage between matthew costello and mary mcannally, took place at holy family catholic church standish street, liverpool 9th november 1863.
occupation blacksmith, matthews fathers name is written as paseale costello, occupation shop keeper, thats the only information on the cert about his father, mother is not even mentioned.
marys father is daniel mcannally and his occupation is listed as either a whitesmith or mhitesmith (cant undestand the writing)
at the bottom it says this mariage was solemnised by xthe mark of matthew costello and x the mark of mary mcannally.
the witneses were marys parents signed by her father daniel mcannally and x the mark of ellen mcannally. so i think now costello was his originall name, as im thinking when my mother told me of his name castellen maybe she couldent remember exactly what it was, so maybe it really was costella the both names sound similar dont they?
pat
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 4:48 pm    Post subject: Re: castellian Reply with quote

p.duvall wrote:
matthews fathers name is written as paseale costello

Hi Pat,

More than likely is fathers given name was Pasquale.

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