x
Toggle Content Register or Login  -  March 29, 2024, 9:37 am
Toggle Content User Info

Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: LucilleDZ
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 2016

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 233
Total: 233
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: My Account
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Photo Gallery
13: My Account
14: Community Forums
15: Statistics
16: Community Forums
17: My Account
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Photo Gallery
25: My Account
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: My Account
30: My Account
31: Community Forums
32: My Account
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Photo Gallery
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: My Account
46: Community Forums
47: My Account
48: Community Forums
49: My Account
50: My Account
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: My Account
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: My Account
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Community Forums
63: Statistics
64: Photo Gallery
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: My Account
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: My Account
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: My Account
75: My Account
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: My Account
80: Home
81: Home
82: Statistics
83: My Account
84: Community Forums
85: Statistics
86: My Account
87: My Account
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: My Account
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Home
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: My Account
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Photo Gallery
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: My Account
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Photo Gallery
112: Home
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Statistics
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: My Account
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: My Account
130: My Account
131: Photo Gallery
132: Community Forums
133: Photo Gallery
134: Statistics
135: My Account
136: Home
137: Community Forums
138: Photo Gallery
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: My Account
142: My Account
143: My Account
144: My Account
145: Community Forums
146: Photo Gallery
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: My Account
150: My Account
151: Statistics
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: My Account
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Statistics
162: My Account
163: Community Forums
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: My Account
167: Community Forums
168: My Account
169: My Account
170: My Account
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: My Account
175: Stories Archive
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Community Forums
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: My Account
190: Community Forums
191: Statistics
192: Community Forums
193: My Account
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: My Account
199: Community Forums
200: Community Forums
201: My Account
202: Statistics
203: My Account
204: My Account
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: My Account
209: My Account
210: Community Forums
211: My Account
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: My Account
216: Statistics
217: Community Forums
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: My Account
223: My Account
224: Community Forums
225: Home
226: My Account
227: My Account
228: Community Forums
229: Statistics
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Toggle Content Main Menu
Toggle Content Last Posts
Last 10 Forum Messages

bocca
Last post by tennino in General Discussion Groups on Jan 16, 2021 at 16:56:41

Towns in Frosinone that were part of former Vatican States a
Last post by Italysearcher in Central Italy on Feb 19, 2019 at 09:15:58

Dual Citizenship
Last post by Curci-Ghio in General Discussion Groups on Nov 18, 2018 at 15:30:54

Please Help Translate Letter
Last post by nuccia in Translations on Oct 20, 2018 at 06:18:43

Family in Cittanova
Last post by russojoseph1 in Translations on Oct 14, 2018 at 12:28:20

DNA Testing
Last post by nuccia in General Discussion Groups on Sep 29, 2018 at 10:39:30

Trento -Atto di Nascita - Frazione di Poia, Comune di Comano
Last post by exevans in Northern Italy on Mar 28, 2018 at 00:45:37

Translating written postcard
Last post by mekanic in Translations on Jan 18, 2018 at 13:58:50

Translating written postcard
Last post by mekanic in Translations on Jan 18, 2018 at 13:53:38

State of the Family Record & Other State Records
Last post by debbiemfit in Northern Italy on Jan 02, 2018 at 23:14:28

Toggle Content Help Support this Site
Please support GentediMareGenealogy
Help us by supporting the future development of this site, or simply to say thank you.
Toggle Content EStore
Community Forums › All Things Italian › Translations › Help translating document

     Forum FAQ   Search   Log in to check your private messages   Login  
Help translating document
For help with translating documents or writing letters.
Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum Index Translations Printer Friendly Page

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
tjbrn
Explorer
Explorer


Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Posts: 487
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:52 pm    Post subject: Help translating document Reply with quote

I am having trouble translating some of this document and hope someone will be able to help. I am unable to read Vencenza's surname or Gaetano La Rocca's wife's name. I believe Gaetano La Rocca is deceased. I am also uncertain of the ages and occupations listed. OK, I admit I need a lot of help with this Embarassed

img15.imageshack.us/im...at1832.jpg

_________________
Tom

Scribbling
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 3:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

L’anno 1832, il dì 6 del mese di Gennaio alle ore 23 [seguivano un calcolo delle ore non corrispondente a quello moderno, per cui non si tratta delle attuali 11 p.m.], avanti di noi Antonino Diliberto Sindaco ed Ufficiale dello Stato Civile del Comune di Belmonte, distretto di Palermo, valle di Palermo, sono comparsi nella casa comunale Ignazio Dragotto, di anni 24 nato in Belmonte, distretto di Palermo, valle di Palermo di professione contadino, domiciliato in Belmonte, figlio di Gaspare Dragotto di anni 50, di professione bordonaio, domiciliato in questo sudetto Comune, e di Vincenza Martorana di anni 46 domiciliata quivi, ed Andriana(!) La Rocca di anni 22, nata in Belmonte, domiciliata quivi, figlia del fu Gaetano La Rocca e di Marianna Ribaudo di anni 40, domiciliata quivi…


Ciao
Luca
Back to top
View user's profile
tjbrn
Explorer
Explorer


Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Posts: 487
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 5:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Grazie, Luca. What is bordonaio? And I am curious about this: Andriana(!)

_________________
Tom

Scribbling
Back to top
View user's profile
Carole
Admin
Admin


Joined: Jul 10, 2007
Posts: 1662
Location: Valtellina - Near Lake Como

PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 5:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Luca wrote:
L’anno 1832, il dì 6 del mese di Gennaio alle ore 23 [seguivano un calcolo delle ore non corrispondente a quello moderno, per cui non si tratta delle attuali 11 p.m.], avanti di noi Antonino Diliberto Sindaco ed Ufficiale dello Stato Civile del Comune di Belmonte, distretto di Palermo, valle di Palermo, sono comparsi nella casa comunale Ignazio Dragotto, di anni 24 nato in Belmonte, distretto di Palermo, valle di Palermo di professione contadino, domiciliato in Belmonte, figlio di Gaspare Dragotto di anni 50, di professione bordonaio, domiciliato in questo sudetto Comune, e di Vincenza Martorana di anni 46 domiciliata quivi, ed Andriana(!) La Rocca di anni 22, nata in Belmonte, domiciliata quivi, figlia del fu Gaetano La Rocca e di Marianna Ribaudo di anni 40, domiciliata quivi…


Ciao
Luca



Translation

In the year of 1832, the 6th day of the month of January at the 23rd hour (here follows a calulation of the hour corresponding to modern time, and for that reason you are not dealing with the actual 11pm) before me Antonino Diliberto Mayor and State Registrar of the Comune of Belmonte, in the District of Palermo, Palermo valley there appeared in the town hall Ignazio Dragotto, aged 24 born in Belmonte, District of Palermo, Palermo valley son of Gaspare Dragotto aged 50 by professione fisherman**, resident in the above named Comune, and of Vincenza Martorana aged 46 resident here too, and Andriana(!) La Rocca aged 22, born in Belmonte, residente here as well, daughter of the late Gaetano La Rocca and of Marianna Ribaudo aged 40, also resident here...

**bordonaio=abbrev. of bordonario = fisherman


Carole

_________________

Researching: EDMED, SAVILL, TYSON, NEWCOMBE, STAPLETON, GUNTER, STAPLES
If you think education is expensive -try ignorance!

>Expats in Italy<
Come and join 'Dork and Friends'! >New Blog<


Last edited by Carole on Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:24 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 6:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Ottimo Carole. Nella traduzione hai però saltato un piccolissimo pezzo: "ed Andriana(!) La Rocca di anni 22, nata in Belmonte, domiciliata quivi," Wink

L.
Back to top
View user's profile
Carole
Admin
Admin


Joined: Jul 10, 2007
Posts: 1662
Location: Valtellina - Near Lake Como

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:25 am    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Luca wrote:
Ottimo Carole. Nella traduzione hai però saltato un piccolissimo pezzo: "ed Andriana(!) La Rocca di anni 22, nata in Belmonte, domiciliata quivi," Wink

L.

Ooops... sorry. Embarassed

Now corrected!

_________________

Researching: EDMED, SAVILL, TYSON, NEWCOMBE, STAPLETON, GUNTER, STAPLES
If you think education is expensive -try ignorance!

>Expats in Italy<
Come and join 'Dork and Friends'! >New Blog<
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:39 am    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

tjbrn wrote:
And I am curious about this: Andriana(!)
I'm not sure of the correct spelling of that name: maybe it's written Andreana and not Andriana. This a page in italian about the name: www.umbriain.it/nomi/andrea.htm

Ciao
Luca
Back to top
View user's profile
tjbrn
Explorer
Explorer


Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Posts: 487
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 11:02 am    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Thanks Carole and Luca, as always you make a great team!

I found another document dated five years later.

img193.imageshack.us/i/1837id.jpg/

This leads one to believe that the first wife died. At least some of the ages seem to advance appropriately on the ones that I am able to read.

_________________
Tom

Scribbling
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 11:36 am    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

L’anno 1837, il dì 21 del mese di Gennaio alle ore 24 avanti di noi Agostino Ritti Sindaco ed Ufficiale dello Stato Civile del Comune di Belmonte, distretto di Palermo, valle di Palermo, sono comparsi nella casa comunale Ignazio Dragotto, di anni 28 nato in Belmonte, distretto di Palermo, valle di Palermo di professione contadino, domiciliato in Belmonte, figlio di Gaspare Dragotto di anni 55, di professione contadino, domiciliato in questo sudetto Comune, e di Vincenza Martorana in Dragotto di anni 50 domiciliata quivi, e Stefana di Paola di anni 20, nata in Belmonte, domiciliata quivi, figlia di Giovanni di Paola di anni 50 di professione contadino, domiciliato in questo comune, e della fu Felicia di Literno(!)...

If you have the films concerning the marriages in Belmonte of the years 1832-1836, then you can verify if Ignazio remarried in the meantime. As an alternative, you can check the death records to find if Andreana really died after that birth.

Luca
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

I'm not sure about the word bordonaio. It doesn't seem to be fisherman but, maybe, "conduttore di muli" ( tlio.ovi.cnr.it/voci/006428.htm ) Confused

L.

edit to correct the link.


Last edited by Luca on Fri Aug 21, 2009 5:36 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile
tjbrn
Explorer
Explorer


Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Posts: 487
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 5:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Luca, am I correct in assuming that these documents are only a promise to marry, a betrothal so without a marriage certificate to corroborate the event I cannot assume that the two who are betrothed ever married. At least they identify Ignazio's parents.

_________________
Tom

Scribbling
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 5:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Luca wrote:
.. As an alternative, you can check the death records to find if Andreana really died after that birth.
Embarassed Sorry, i writed birth instead of marriage!!!

To reply to your question: no, it's not only a promise to marry, because on the right column it's said:

L'anno 1832, il dì 8 del mese di gennaio il parroco di questa chiesa matrice ci ha rimessa una delle copie della controscritta [= scritta accanto] promessa, in pié della quale [= in fondo alla quale] ha certificato che la celebrazione del matrimonio è seguita nel giorno 8 del mese di gennaio 1832 alla presenza dei testimoni

So the marriage took place in the day 8 of the same month of january 1832.

Luca
Back to top
View user's profile
tjbrn
Explorer
Explorer


Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Posts: 487
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:07 am    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

Thanks, Luca. I'll begin searching to see if the records you mentioned are available. Meanwhile, I have a marriage document for Ignazio sister, Gaetana--that was my mother's name as well. I believe the groom's name is Mazzola but I cannot decipher his given name and I am also uncertain of his mother's name. I am also curious about the way the wife's name is listed on some of these documents, for example: Saveria Chi!!! in Mazzola

img233.imageshack.us/i...gotto.jpg/

_________________
Tom

Scribbling
Back to top
View user's profile
Luca
Translator
Translator


Joined: Jan 22, 2008
Posts: 695
Location: Terni - Italy

PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 4:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

tjbrn wrote:
... but I cannot decipher his given name
So do I Rolling Eyes

and I am also uncertain of his mother's name.
Maybe, Saveria [or Rosaria... but i think you are right: Saveria] Chinnici in Mazzola

I am also curious about the way the wife's name is listed on some of these documents, for example: Saveria Chi!!! in Mazzola
It's only a way to say that she was the "legal" wife of Gaetano, and that his son was not born "out of marriage"

Luca
Back to top
View user's profile
tjbrn
Explorer
Explorer


Joined: Jan 24, 2008
Posts: 487
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:36 am    Post subject: Re: Help translating document Reply with quote

The following marriage document of Nicolo Dragotto and Teresa Italiano contains considerable information in the script at the bottom of the document which I don't understand. I am also having difficulty with Teresa Italiano's mother's surname.

I'm sorry to be such a bother but I have launched back into my genealogy efforts with renewed interest after a rather long period of inactivity and while I am am to translate marginally better, I still cannot decipher the handwriting with any consistency.

img253.imageshack.us/i...iager.jpg/

_________________
Tom

Scribbling
Back to top
View user's profile
  Page 1 of 8All times are GMT - 4 Hours

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum Index Translations Printer Friendly Page

  
 
Jump to:  



You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum



Hosted By Site5.com
The logos and trademarks used on this site are the property of Gente di Mare Genealogy.
We are not responsible for comments posted by our users, as they are the opinions of the poster.
Interactive software released under GNU GPL, Code Credits, Privacy Policy
TCD_ItalianGene © Gente di Mare Genealogy